Strengthening Marriage Through Faith, Humility, and Obedience – w/ Austin J. Holt

Aaron Smith (00:59)
Everyone welcome back to the marriage after God podcast. here with Austin J. Holt. Welcome to the show, Austin.

Austin J. Holt (01:05)
Hey, thank you, Aaron. Man, it’s a pleasure to be on here with you today.

Aaron Smith (01:08)
Austin we got connected through a mutual friend and I’m thankful for that because this mutual friends awesome and and Actually as we’re recording this his episode that I recorded with him and his wife Just went live yesterday So yeah, so Mike Mike and his wife their their episodes live now And so that’s pretty awesome. You should go check it out but Austin why don’t you

Austin J. Holt (01:15)
Yeah.

No way.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They’re amazing people.

Aaron Smith (01:36)
I always like to start with, because I don’t know how much of my audience knows who you are, start with your background. Like who are you? How long have been married? What’s your wife’s name? How many kids you got? That sort of thing.

Austin J. Holt (01:47)
Yeah, so man again, it’s great to be on here. So my wife and I have been married for 14 years. This October will be 14 years. We live in the Kansas City area. We live in a little kind of farm rural community on our own little hobby farm and you know animals and chickens and goats and you know the whole thing. My wife’s name is Rachel. We’ve got four kids, 10, 7, 5, and 3. Three girls and a boy.

and I grew up in about the same 20 mile bubble pretty much my whole life and like I said now we reside in a little farm town about 25 minutes where I grew up.

Aaron Smith (02:24)
Awesome. Were you raised a Christian? your wife raised a Christian? You guys have like Christian backgrounds?

Austin J. Holt (02:29)
Yeah,

yeah we were both raised in the church for the most part growing up my parents were always working in the church in some levels and still do today actually. Actually both my parents still work in churches. Rachel Simmler raised in the church as well and we were raised about probably 10 miles from each other actually.

Aaron Smith (02:49)
Did you guys know each other growing up? School or anything like that or?

Austin J. Holt (02:51)
No,

no, we met actually one of my closest friends at the time. We rented. We both taught. He taught piano lessons. I taught guitar lessons and we rented space at the studio. And one day, like we both had a break and we didn’t have a student show up. And he’s like, dude, you got to come meet this girl. I’m totally going to marry her. She’s amazing. And and which I didn’t I did not jump in there. But but essentially he introduced me to Rachel and we just instantly became best friends.

Aaron Smith (03:10)
no.

Austin J. Holt (03:20)
We were best friends for about eight, nine months before we started dating and still friends with my buddy who introduced us and now he’s married with four kids as well and they’re doing awesome. So yeah. yeah. Yeah. Actually the funny thing was, man, like even I was dating a different girl when I met my wife at the time and about probably four or five months into Rachel and I’s really, really, really powerful friendship. Even that buddy was like, he’s like, dude, like, why aren’t you

Aaron Smith (03:28)
That’s funny. Do you guys joke about that when you guys get together? A different life would have been.

Austin J. Holt (03:48)
It’s like, aren’t you dating Rachel, man? Like you guys are like literally like this like heavenly match for each other. And I was like, ⁓ it’s interesting you’d say that, you know, anyways, long story short, we later ended up dating and we dated for 16 months before we got married. And yeah, so there we go.

Aaron Smith (04:07)
It’s very similar

to my wife and I, we were friends for about a year before we started dating. then we dated for, gosh, I’m going to mess this up. My wife would be like, you always mess up dates. think it was like a year and a half. And then we got married. so very quick.

Austin J. Holt (04:21)
Yeah.

Yeah,

I think we dated for a year and engaged for six months. Yeah, I think it was that.

Aaron Smith (04:31)
That’s what it was. Yep. We were, yeah, dated for a

year and we were engaged for about six months. That’s what it was. Yeah. And then she’d be sitting, if she was sitting right next me, she’d be looking at me like, cause I do mess up dates all the time in my life. I don’t know, timeframes, dates. I can’t remember my childhood. My memory is horrible. You said you’re on a hobby farm. We talked about this. We had a meeting of what, a month ago and I was just laughing with you, just saying how hobby farms, that used to just be normal farms.

Austin J. Holt (04:37)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Aaron Smith (05:01)
Everyone used to just have chickens and goats and cows and that was the thing. Self-sustaining was the norm and now it’s like you’re like, wow, you’re going on. You’re like, actually, I’m just trying to do things on my own.

Austin J. Holt (05:01)
Yeah, I know,

Yeah.

I just want my own goat milk and my own chicken eggs. And because it’s funny, sometimes I’ll tell people, yeah, we live on a farm and they’re like, ⁓ how many head of cattle do you have? And I’m like, well, you know, it’s I don’t. Yeah, we’re not a production farm. We’re just we’re producing for six people and, you know, the occasional eggs to give to our neighbors and stuff. But yeah, it’s fun.

Aaron Smith (05:24)
How many hay cattle? Not a production farm. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah,

one cow goes a long way. It’s like a year and a half of meat.

Austin J. Holt (05:38)
Yes, yeah. And luckily I’ve got family that are in the ranching cattle business and we’ve got neighbors that are in the cattle business too. So it’s like pretty much no matter what way you leave my farm, you’ll see like American Angus everywhere. So just grab one off the side of the road if you got to.

Aaron Smith (05:52)
Yummy.

Yep. ⁓ man, I love beef.

Austin J. Holt (05:57)
I do too.

That’s yeah. Most of my diet is just beef.

Aaron Smith (06:01)
Dude, so tell me some of your guys’ story or like early marriage story and because I know that you and your wife and we can talk about this in a little bit are now doing ministry together. You have a podcast. You do some coaching. But what was some of the early, you know, story of, you know, Austin and it’s Rachel, is your wife’s name? Austin and Rachel, that kind of, you know, God moved in you. We always talk to our community about all the little yeses in our life that we say to God that

Austin J. Holt (06:18)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Aaron Smith (06:30)
They build

into bigger yeses. What was some of those, that story early on that later on morphed into what you guys are doing now?

Austin J. Holt (06:38)
Yeah, oh man, so many things. You know, when Rachel and I met, again, we just, we became best friends. And I remember the girls dating at the time and I were, you we were, you know, we were doing fine and everything. But I remember one day I was at a coffee shop. My wife at the time managed this coffee shop and a shout out to Scooter’s Coffee. But, and I was just watching her work and I remember thinking to myself, I was like, you know, like that’s the kind of girl I want to marry.

Like she’s just very servant-hearted, love people just on another level of any other woman that I knew and was very, very forward about her faith. You could just tell that there was something different about my wife. And I remember I had this moment with God where it was like God was like, that’s the kind of woman I want you to marry. And then I remember right after that thought was like, I think I could actually marry her. And then my next thought was like, I should probably not be dating the girl that I’m dating. And so…

that relationship ended and then it was still a little while later that Rachel and I started dating. But a lot of God things happened between that moment and Rachel and I starting to date. We were already doing youth ministry together. We were already starting to do some college ministry together. We actually were already as friends in business together. And which was crazy. And it was like every person that knew us would always ask like before we were dating, they’re like, why aren’t you dating? really? Well,

Aaron Smith (08:00)
This is like my wife and I story exactly.

Austin J. Holt (08:04)
I love that because if you keep saying that, this is going to get crazier. But it’s going to get I love it, though. And so at the time, my wife had a wedding photography company. And and so like. Are you kidding me? All right, this is going to get weird then. All right. So so she’s a photographer. And at the time, I was super heavy in real estate, owned real estate brokerage.

Aaron Smith (08:08)
gonna get weird. Yep.

Dude, we did wedding photography. Stop it. No, I’m not kidding. It was so weird.

Austin J. Holt (08:31)
And I did a lot of business consulting. so just as her friend, I was helping her get her LLC set up, helping her get the right insurances. And then I was helping her figure out, stop messing with these one, two photo shoots. If you make this much money on weddings, get into weddings. And so I helped her really double, triple her business in the wedding space. She eventually went full time. We started shooting together when we were engaged. And I was telling you, Erin, this before we start recording. But my dad has always been in the multimedia industry.

Aaron Smith (08:46)
Mm-hmm.

Austin J. Holt (08:59)
film commercials and stuff like that. And so I grew up with a camera in my hand with my dad editing video and all that. And so I didn’t care a ton about that until I met Rachel and realized, okay, she’s a photog. And I was like, all right, I’m gonna get back into, I’m gonna care about cameras again. And so we started shooting weddings together. And then so we get engaged and we get married. And then we ended up like building a huge wedding photography company and we were one of the top wedding.

Aaron Smith (09:11)
I can use this. Yep.

you

Austin J. Holt (09:27)
photography, husband and wife couples in all of Kansas City. so we shot together, we ran this company together, we had employees, we did really high end weddings, it was really fun business. And that was actually the segue into the marriage industry. And so we started having kids, shooting weddings got hard. So what about you guys? Did you guys like shoot weddings together too?

Aaron Smith (09:50)
Yes. when you guys, how old were you guys when you’re doing all this?

Austin J. Holt (09:55)
20 like yeah 22 to like upper 20 something like that. can’t remember Rachel did it before me

Aaron Smith (09:58)
Mid-twenties maybe?

Yeah, that

was similar for us, early twenties, 21, 22, 23. We started doing wedding photography after we got married though. But it was one of our, I’ve done photography for a long time and my wife wanted to get into it. And when we wanted to get a debt to pay off my school loans, which I went to school for videography, 3D animation, production, that sort of thing. So there’s some connections there too. You know, we started doing

Austin J. Holt (10:12)
Okay.

Nice. Yeah.

Aaron Smith (10:33)
wedding shoots. We started doing family shoots and friend shoots and then the friend of the friend of ours was like, Hey, I’m getting married. Will you shoot my wedding? We’re like, sure. And that that’s how we got out of debt was we were shooting weddings on the weekends. Jennifer, my wife was shooting, you know, maternity shoots and babies. And we were just literally taking every job we could until we were out of debt. And then after we were out of debt, it like slowly fizzled out of like, we don’t want to do this. But that was the transition from doing

wedding photography and photography into, I was working a bunch of other, not a bunch of other, I had other jobs that I was doing full time. And then we transitioned into online ministry. My wife’s starting a blog and just very similar, weird, very similar. We did youth ministry together. As friends, I brought her in. was a youth pastor for a little bit and brought her in working with me with the youth.

Austin J. Holt (11:14)
Yeah.

Dude, that’s…

Aaron Smith (11:31)
It’s so weird. It’s almost like God’s got like these

Austin J. Holt (11:31)
The youth pastor! Yep, that’s right.

Aaron Smith (11:33)
archetypes. He’s like, there’s these kinds of people and they’re going to do these kinds of things. It’s crazy.

Austin J. Holt (11:38)
Dude, it’s so real, Yeah,

so we did youth ministry together, college ministry together, and we had the wedding photography company. we did things so differently, man. Every year, we’d throw this huge party where we’d invite all the couples over to our house. We’d cater this big dinner. It was our client appreciation party. And I’d prepare this little speech about marriage. And we’d give little marriage tips and things like that. And I remember one day, I’ve got a program where I help men get unaddicted from pornography.

I was already doing coaching at this point. So when I got out of real estate, I got in coaching full time and we were just blowing up the wedding photography company. So at the time I was like 23 or 24. I was we were shooting weddings. I was running the business and then I was doing coaching and consulting work. And so I was doing business coaching, some life coaching, and it was already doing some marriage coaching. It’s all connected. So I mean, you do it all. But but what we noticed was all these couples were coming to us for marriage advice. Like it was just like in. I remember one day we were

We just had our second baby and Rachel’s like, I just don’t know if I can do weddings anymore. It’s so hard to like we’re shooting and I got to like go to the bathroom and pump and then go back and shoot and find like a fridge for my milk. Like it was just too difficult. And we knew that we weren’t going to give up, you know, 30 Saturdays a year for the rest of our life in this business. And so we decided that we were going to we’re going to sell the business and get out of it. And of course, when you decide to get out of a business that you book, you know, 16 months in advance, it’s like

Aaron Smith (12:45)
Cheers.

Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (13:06)
We made the decision to get out and then we were like, yeah, we have like 16 more months of weddings to do. so then of course we had a lot more work to do. But I remember one day we were in our Jacuzzi and I was talking about this program that I was already selling and already working with men on and Rachel was like, you know, she’s like, God really came to me with this idea of like, we should, as we’re transitioning out of the wedding industry that God’s calling us to the marriage industry.

And I was like, I literally felt God. That’s like we sat down and we were like, hey, I want to tell you something. I want to tell you something. Well, you you tell me first. And we came to each other with the exact same thought. And it was like, let’s get into blessing marriages. And we were already really proactive about our marriage, reading books, getting counseling. We looked for resources that were really like our core program that we have with CCM, with Conscious Christian Marriage, is a group coaching program. And we looked for a program like this forever. Couldn’t find anything. And

as we knew we couldn’t really scale working with couples one-on-one, which we do just on a very limited basis. And we’re like, let’s create a program that would almost feel like a small group, but heavily marriage focused, high accountability that meets regularly. And so we created this program and we started traveling all around the country, getting training and certifications and working with some of the really the best minds, excuse me, in the world on marriage and just created the program that we could not find. And

It was amazing how God just like paved the way like every step of this and just looking back at what we went through in youth ministry together, college ministry together. Our second year of marriage, Rachel’s parents got divorced and excuse me, was the it was like the single hardest thing we ever went through and that, you know, that we have went through and processed, you know, as we’ve been married for 14 years now.

Aaron Smith (14:38)
you.

Austin J. Holt (14:57)
and it was like this is just such evidence for how God takes ⁓ you know what the enemy meant for evil and he makes it for good right and it was almost like as we were processing and dealing with Rachel’s parents divorce it just fueled this fire that we had to help serve other couples in their marriages and because it was a total blind side like Rachel had kind of what looked like the picturesque like Christian family like always at church always in ministry and ⁓

Aaron Smith (15:04)
.

Mm-hmm.

Austin J. Holt (15:24)
just secretly behind the scenes, it just wasn’t good. And then it finally blew up. so, like, I just look back and I see, like, God’s hand in all the best ways and what seemed like all the hardest ways at the time. And because of all those things, it propelled us into the place we are now where we’re impacting marriages all over the world. but yeah, man, that’s like, that’s a glimpse of our story. But like, we’ve always been self-employed, always been entrepreneurs together.

But yeah, like our first business together was wedding photography, man. was, that is hilarious that you guys know. That is so funny, man. About once a year, usually we’re laying in bed and I’ll roll over and I’ll be like, I just like remembered that we used to shoot weddings every weekend and now we don’t. It’s still like nine years ago and I’m like, you know.

Aaron Smith (15:57)
I don’t miss it.

Yeah.

So I got a question for you. You guys are, you’re talking about all this, this ministry and like just the way God has influenced it. But you said something that I just want to dig in on. You said, you and your wife from the beginning have always been investing in your marriage, like, you know, reading books and courses and looking for these things. Can I ask why? Why were you doing that? was it just, this is what we should do? Or was there something?

Austin J. Holt (16:34)
Mmm.

Aaron Smith (16:44)
you know, motivating you and pushing you was there issues you guys were going through? What was the what was in the darkness that was causing you guys to look for the light?

Austin J. Holt (16:52)
Yeah, man. Well, first of all, and this is going to sound like the most Christian ease answer, but honest to goodness, man, we both. Yeah, that’s right. That’s right. Jesus, man, like we both felt.

Aaron Smith (17:00)
Jesus. Some of the kids ask

questions, the kids are always like, Jesus. You’re like, yeah, okay, yes. What more specifically?

Austin J. Holt (17:07)
Yes, and

yeah more specifically than that. Yeah man, we both felt a deep unquestionable conviction even in our dating years and it was just this like literal almost audible not even voice from God but this felt sense of like your marriage will be the number one way you worship me. It will be the number one way that people want to know about me through you will be through how you love each other.

And so even when were dating, and Rachel and I’s stories were fairly different. She really only had maybe one serious relationship by the time that we were dating. And I had dated a lot of women and I was always in long-term committed relationships. She really was not. And thank the good Lord, we in a more healthy way, not so much like the typical late 90s purity culture, but like we had a lot of really good people and mentors around us growing up. so like we had both

had the gift of having saved ourselves from marriage. And my story was not like Rachel’s. Rachel had actually never even kissed a man before. I was her first kiss on our wedding day. And I’m not even saying that I, say that again.

Aaron Smith (18:18)
Wow, lucky you, That’s cool. Good for her,

I was just saying good for her, too. That’s uncommon.

Austin J. Holt (18:26)
Yeah. And,

you know, as we, you know, counsel couples now, which, you know, we do a fair amount of premarital as well, you know, we don’t have enough time to get into this. like, I’m not even saying that I recommend that if a couple is if a Christian couple’s engaged and they know they’re going to be married, like to wait until their wedding day to have their first kiss. Like that was a thing for Rachel and I. I’m not saying that’s a blanket statement for everyone, but it was really powerful. And I think part of what motivated a lot of sanctity in our marriage was like

Yeah, like even though Rachel and I both had, you know, saved ourselves from marriage, like my past looked very different from hers, you know, in terms of like what could have been saved for marriage, you know. And so I think I just felt this internal conviction of like, you know, I didn’t save as much as I could have for Rachel, she did for me. And so I want to try to honor her gift and I’m going to do everything I can to learn to grow, to heal, to show up for her because that’s what I believe she deserved. And I believe that’s what God was calling me to. And so

Because we had that almost dichotomy, right? Of like, you Rachel’s like, I’ve never kissed a guy. And here’s me who like I had intimacy with a lot of like a lot of people before Rachel that I just felt this like deep conviction to be like, I’m gonna, I’m gonna be the best husband on the freaking planet for her, like, and I’m gonna do my best to lead us and, and, you know, and I think we also just being in the, I mean, I guess this was later, like being in the wedding industry, but even before that, man, like I just, you know,

Aaron Smith (19:35)
Yeah.

Mm.

Austin J. Holt (19:56)
I mean, my parents had a solid marriage, but it’s still, there weren’t that many marriages in our world that I could look to and be like, that’s like a next level marriage. And we honestly kind of felt alone in that, but we had some pretty good mentors, like some different people at our church, and we’d have married couples come and speak to youth group. And there were times where there were moments that I felt really convicted or inspired, but big thing, honestly, man,

Aaron Smith (20:09)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (20:25)
God really convicted us. God really convicted my heart to lead in our marriage. to me, leadership meant a whole lot more than just, hey, let’s do three premarital counseling sessions and call it good. know, God was like, you know, study my word for this, study these books for this, take these courses for this. Like go and seek out people that know way more about marriage than you do and give your wife the gift that she deserves of being a really high quality husband, you know, and.

Aaron Smith (20:37)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (20:56)
Yeah, I mean, that’s a piece of it for sure.

Aaron Smith (20:59)
Is that something you guys are still pursuing pretty regularly, continuing education on marriage?

Austin J. Holt (21:02)
Yeah.

yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We have people that pour into us. You we have coaches that pour into us. You know, we’ve got at any given point in time some stack of books or or even it’s interesting for us because we’re constantly, you know, being trained in different modalities and different techniques in the marriage counseling, you coaching space. And so like as even we’re being trained or we’re training others, it’s like it’s a constant

training in our own marriage, you know, because it’s all coming from the same well, right? And it’s it never fails, man. Like when even when we’re out training, like we do live training for other marriage counselors and we’ll go out and do training for the marriage counselors. And it’s just so funny how no matter what we’re doing, it’s almost like live in front of the group. We will come up with some way to even work things out in front of people using the methods we’re teaching. So it’s a constant thing. It it never ends.

Aaron Smith (21:53)
Mm-hmm.

I was going to ask you, you kind of mentioned it just now, but do you find yourself at conflict sometimes internally of you’re sharing something, you’re teaching something and you’re like, man, I need to be walking on that or I haven’t been walking in that or, you know, that living by the example. That’s something I’m constantly confronted with, like encouraging something just in biblical things and be like, like I am not doing that. Do you guys find yourself?

Austin J. Holt (22:25)
Yeah.

Aaron Smith (22:27)
in that situation sometimes.

Austin J. Holt (22:28)
Yeah, man. you know, there’s not many people, I think you can understand this, there’s not many people that can understand the pressure of being someone who pours into and is responsible for pouring into marriages and constantly reflecting on your own, you know, and, you know, the pressure sometimes we feel where it’s like, you know, we’re we’re about to jump on a live call in front of, you know, couples in front of the, you know, all over the country or we’re about to speak on stage somewhere or present at a church or you name it.

Aaron Smith (22:45)
yeah.

Austin J. Holt (22:57)
And sometimes we have these moments of like, are we really qualified for this? And I really believe, and I could say the other kind of cliche thing about how God always, he doesn’t always call the qualified, but he qualifies the called. And I look at different characters in the Bible that God used that were imperfect, that he through their imperfectness, God’s power was made perfect. And through our weaknesses, power is made perfect. But there’s definitely been times where it’s like,

Aaron Smith (23:02)
Hmm.

Mm.

Austin J. Holt (23:25)
As I’m teaching, I’m constantly in a state of reflection on our own marriage because, and it’s not because we have all these problems because honestly, we don’t. We’ve done the hard gut wrenching work. It’s funny when we do events and stuff and we’re working with couples like workshops and there might be 30, 40, 50 couples there and we’re calling couples up and we’re doing stuff or it’s on Zoom in our program and we can tell people like, we’ve been on the other side of this and we are on the other side of this. We’ve had our stuff worked out in us so we know what it feels like.

We don’t teach anything that we haven’t gone through. But there’s definitely times, especially with integrity, just the topic of integrity, That’s something we talk about all the time about how to be men and women of integrity. And that’s one of the hardest things I’ve found to teach on because no matter how high integrity we are, we can always be in more integrity. And that’s where grace comes in, right? That’s where I really believe grace.

Aaron Smith (24:16)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (24:22)
becomes so prevalent in our life is when we look at God and say, God, I don’t know what I don’t know. There are certain gaps that I cannot cross without you. And that’s where our reliance on the Holy Spirit comes into play because it’s like, God, I’ll do everything I can. I’m going to submit my heart, my soul, my spirit, my strength, my soul, my strength, and I’m going to give you everything, God. It’s kind like if you’ve ever done any type of like healing work. you know, there’s times where Rachel and I through, we serve in different, you know, prayer teams and stuff like that. And there have been times where

Aaron Smith (24:39)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (24:51)
We’ve been at these church services and people are coming up for healing. And we’re just like, God, we can do nothing without you. Like, this is only going to be effective if you are present, if you bridge the gap for us, you know? And there’s a lot of things in the marriage space that are just like that, you know, where only the Holy Spirit can heal certain wounds, can help us connect certain dots. You know, all therapy modalities that we use and teach, we’re constantly…

Aaron Smith (25:00)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (25:16)
you praying that the Holy Spirit would use what we’re doing and bring us clarity bring us wisdom bring us knowledge bring us information you know like helping people go into either you know their past or their trauma or past hurt relationships all those things like we’re you know we might use a therapy modality but the whole time we’re like Holy Spirit without you this won’t work like you have to lead us guide us illuminate for us help us connect the dots help us

Aaron Smith (25:28)
Mm-hmm.

Austin J. Holt (25:42)
Help us have those metanoias, those epiphanies, those revelations, those breakthroughs. But yeah, long answer to your question. Yeah, man, there’s definitely times where Rachel and I will talk and we’re like, there’s so much at stake here that we have to submit ourselves to the highest possible level of transparency, accountability, you know, in our own marriage.

Aaron Smith (26:01)
Okay.

I want to, for my listeners, just highlight a few things that you said that it’s making me think of. Just first and foremost, the feeling qualified. You’re in a ministry and a business, right? Where you have to have, people are going to be expecting some level of qualification, some level of you’re living the sound, especially in coaching, life coaching, any sort of coaching. It’s like, the reason I’m listening to you is because you’re doing something I want to know how to do. But I want to…

Austin J. Holt (26:23)
Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron Smith (26:34)
point out to all my listeners, the husbands and the wives to recognize that whether they’re in doing what you’re doing or what I’m doing, their marriage is that same level of importance. Their influence in this world and to their children. I mean, you talked about your wife and late in her life, like she’s in her twenties, her parents getting divorced and the devastation that caused her. She’s not a little child and it’s still caused devastation. probably still has effects even to this day that that

Austin J. Holt (26:44)
Yeah, that’s right.

Yeah. Yep.

Aaron Smith (27:03)
that divorce not just on her parents, but on her, you, on the whole, all of the circles in their life. And so I just want the marriages listening, the husbands and the wives to recognize that their marriage, just like your marriage, just like my marriage for the believer, our marriages are exactly what you talked about earlier is this is the most evident thing that we’re going to show the world of Christ’s love. And we talked about this in our book, the Marriage After God book is the

Austin J. Holt (27:26)
That’s right.

Ahem.

Aaron Smith (27:32)
the fact that our marriages are preaching a gospel. Does it mean it’s preaching the gospel? It’s preaching a gospel. What news is it giving? Is it giving a message of infidelity? Is it giving a message of lack of faithfulness? Or is it giving a message of redemption and restoration and agape love to the world, showing that picture of Christ in the church? And so whether or not you are in some

Austin J. Holt (27:35)
That’s right.

Aaron Smith (28:02)
you know, outward facing, intentional ministry as a couple. You definitely have that to each other. Husbands have that to their wives and wives have that to each other. whether or not you feel qualified to do it, you’re to do it. And to recognize that our feelings of qualification shouldn’t hinder us from taking the next right step, saying, Holy Spirit, teach me how to be the leader in my home. Teach me how to walk with my wife in an understanding way. Even I

Austin J. Holt (28:07)
Yeah. Yeah, that’s right.

Aaron Smith (28:31)
this day I’m still asking God, God I don’t know how to walk with my wife and understanding. This is so difficult so teach me. And so I just I wanted to highlight some of the things that you were saying are not unique to you or me. They are they’re generic to believers every yeah exactly.

Austin J. Holt (28:36)
Yeah, that’s right.

That’s right. For everyone and for every leader. Yeah,

because your marriage is your first ministry. Period. End of story. It’s your first ministry. And, know, we have a lot of pastors come to us, you know, that they’re they’re under the pressure of the pulpit as well. And how much more, you know, they feel like imposters, you know, like, how can I be on the pulpit if I’m struggling with my spouse? You know, and a lot of pastors. Exactly. Yeah. And a lot of pastors are scared to even lose the pulpit.

Aaron Smith (28:53)
Absolutely.

There you go.

It shouldn’t be.

Austin J. Holt (29:14)
If people like, well, what if people knew that we’re struggling? It’s like, well, first of all, we never wanted to get to that point. Like, we want to give you support. Like, I don’t believe in reactive support. I believe in proactive support. I believe that I believe there’s no glass ceiling for how good marriage can become. I mean, what a limited mindset we would have about the abundant life that were promised because Christ came. Christ came so we could have life and have it abundantly. And so for anyone listening, no matter where your marriage is at, I’ve never met someone. OK.

Aaron Smith (29:20)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (29:43)
who their marriage could not go another level above. Period. End of story. And that’s because God’s goodness, God’s abundance is unlimited. You know, and if you think your marriage is a 10 out of 10, I challenge you to, you know, restart it and think of it as a one out of 10 and build it back up. You know, and because that ministry is so important because all other ministries are flowing from it. And if that ministry is not well, it’s like it breaks my heart when I hear of moral failures in the church and I see churches collapsing, leadership collapsing.

Aaron Smith (29:50)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (30:13)
It kills me because they didn’t take their marriage ministry seriously enough. And when we do take it seriously, all our other ministry finds itself in more flow, more alignment, and more success. I believe like the Bible tells us in Hebrews that God gives grace to the favor, God opposes the proud but gives grace or favor to the humble. I think that’s Hebrews. Or is that?

Aaron Smith (30:19)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (30:41)
Ephesians. I can’t remember. I think it’s Hebrews. think, yeah. God opposes the proud but gives grace and favor to the humble. And I really do believe. What is it? Is that right? Is it Hebrews?

Aaron Smith (30:52)
I’m just looking it up.

I’m looking it up. It’s James. No, that’s he gives more grace. But he does a quote that therefore it says, God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble, which is I believe a quote. James 4.6, yeah.

Austin J. Holt (30:55)
James!

I think it’s Hebrews 4.6.

It’s… Is it James 4-6?

thought it was Hebrews 4.6. Yeah. so God opposes the proud, but gives grace in favor or grace to the humble. And I don’t know about all you who are listening, but I definitely don’t want God to oppose me. And I really want him to favor me.

Aaron Smith (31:22)
I just talked about this last Sunday at church. We do not want God opposing us.

Austin J. Holt (31:26)
no way.

Yeah Yeah, actually at marriage events. Sometimes what i’ll do is like um, like if we’re either preaching at a church or we’re doing a marriage event i’ll have like i’ll find the biggest strongest dude in the room and i’ll ask him to come up And i’ll be like I want you to oppose me like don’t let me don’t let me walk past you And you know, of course he usually takes as an opportunity to like, you know nearly body slamming And then i’m like and now what I want you to do is I want you to pick me up and carry me around the room You know, it’s kind of funny. He picks me up and carries me around the room and then I talk about the scripture and i’m like

Aaron Smith (31:48)
Yeah, exactly.

Austin J. Holt (31:58)
This is what God wants. OK, like, and he doesn’t want to oppose you and we don’t want to be opposed by him. Imagine if the creator of the universe would carry you. You know, because here’s the thing, like, I don’t believe in the prosperity gospel, but here’s what I do believe. If I’m obedient to God and I obey his commandments and I love my wife and I honor her and I love her as Christ loves the church and I love and honor and lead my children, if I’m obedient to God and I’m faithful to him, my life will prosper.

Aaron Smith (32:00)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Absolutely.

Austin J. Holt (32:28)
And if that’s the prosperity gospel, I’m down with that. I’m not saying that you’re going to get a Lambo in the mail if you’re obedient, but I do believe that if we are obedient, God will bless us. And so if you’re a man or a woman listening to this and guys, especially to the men listening to this.

Aaron Smith (32:40)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (32:46)
There might be a lot of blessing and prosper that God wants to give you, but he’s waiting for you to steward what he’s already given you. He’s waiting for you to steward the gift of your wife and your marriage. Because the amount of men that have come to me and they’re like, man, I just don’t feel God. I don’t feel like my life is in flow or going well. And one of the first things we look at, how are you leading your wife? How are you leading your marriage? Oh, well, we’re kind of stuck or she this or she that. And when he takes full responsibility, steps back into integrity,

Aaron Smith (32:52)
Yep.

Yep.

Austin J. Holt (33:15)
leads his home from a place of being spirit led and self controlled. It’s like all of sudden everything else in his life gets unlocked. And again, if you call that the prosperity gospel, I mean, call it that, but.

Aaron Smith (33:24)
Mm

I think it’s biblical prosperity. The prosperity gospel is a false gospel. Here’s the formula to get more for yourself. James calls it, you ask and you don’t receive because you ask with wrong motives to benefit yourself. This prosperity is the prosperity that God promises. He says, will prosper you. I will bless you if you obey me, if you keep my commands, if you walk with me. I think about Malachi.

Austin J. Holt (33:31)
Yes, yep that’s right. Yep that’s right, the Lambo is a male.

Yeah.

Aaron Smith (33:59)
the last book in the Old Testament, the main problem God has is not that they’re bringing their sacrifices. He’s like, I don’t want these things. He says, you have not been faithful to your wife. He says, you have not been faithful to your wives. And the point he’s making is the faithfulness in general to him is being proved out in their walks with their brides and their faithfulness in their homes.

Austin J. Holt (34:07)
Yep. Yep, not faithful. Yep.

Aaron Smith (34:26)
their children, in their earthly worship of Him in their lives, and they’re not doing it. I think that the biggest problem we’ve had as a church, as the people of God, is we’ve redefined this word ministry. And again, this is the main focus of the Marriage After God book, is we think ministry is something outside the home. It’s something over there.

Austin J. Holt (34:46)
Mm-hmm.

Aaron Smith (34:56)
When we forget and we don’t realize that, the moment we become a Christian, the moment we put our faith in Jesus Christ, the moment we say, I believe in Him and what He has done on the cross for me and His resurrection, and I’m with Him, I’m inviting in Christ, we’re in ministry. We are ministers of the gospel. We are ministers of reconciliation. We become partners with Christ in the work He’s doing in the world. That is what we are.

Austin J. Holt (35:14)
That’s right.

Aaron Smith (35:25)
doesn’t matter if you call yourself pastor or worship leader or if Austin like you, you’re a coach or me, a podcaster and an author. Those are just occupations. We’re all ministers and Paul makes it very clear when he’s telling Timothy how to appoint elders and he’s saying, here’s what an elder must be. And one of the main qualifications is someone who is a husband of one wife

Austin J. Holt (35:35)
Yeah, right, yeah.

Yes.

Aaron Smith (35:52)
and manages his home well. And he says, how can this man manage the household of God if he cannot manage his own home? And that idea of management is not just financial and making sure the roof is over the head and that they have clothes. It’s managing the home like you would manage a church. The spiritual well-being, the physical well-being, the health, the mental, all of those things. And so we, I think we forget like we, the royal we can become lazy and think, well, that’s someone else’s job.

Austin J. Holt (36:09)
Yeah, that’s right.

Aaron Smith (36:22)
Like, no, no, it’s your job.

Austin J. Holt (36:25)
It’s just like

pastoring our kids. like when someone’s like, well, I just haven’t found a good pastor for my kids and yada yada. And I’m like, you are the pastor. You are the pastor to your children. Yeah, right. Yeah. You have not become the pastor yet. And it’s like and I say all this with love. And I know you do, too, because, you know, for a lot of people listening, they just don’t know, like they haven’t been taught, you know, they haven’t been modeled this, you know. And I know for a lot of men. Yeah, that’s that’s right.

Aaron Smith (36:33)
Yeah, you haven’t become the good pastor yet.

Yep, any of us haven’t modeled this at all.

Austin J. Holt (36:51)
And whether they’re a new Christian or even been raised in the church, I know a lot of men that have never heard the sentence before, you are the pastor of your home. Most men are like, I thought the pastor of my church was, you know, you are the pastor of your home, you know, like that’s the pastor of the church. Like you are the pastor of your home. And and when we lead, OK, God wants to honor that, you know, and and it’s so evident. mean, we could just go on and on about the kids piece of that, too,

Aaron Smith (37:04)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (37:20)
I just want people to really be encouraged and to know that you also have permission to focus on your marriage. I know a lot of people that, man, they’re pulled in so many different directions and they almost feel guilty for not being at church enough, not serving at church enough, not for doing all these different things. But God would rather you be serving at your house on Wednesday nights than at youth group on Wednesday nights. period.

Aaron Smith (37:27)
yeah.

Do you know

how much fruit there would be if more, and I’m sure this happens, but it just, if more of these big name pastors would say, would come up and say, I am going to step away for six months voluntarily because I need to work on my marriage.

Austin J. Holt (38:00)
Yes.

Aaron Smith (38:07)
Or, I need to work on my children. I need to be here. I need to be more present. I need to sacrifice this. taking, I’ve talked to the eldership. I’m taking a step back so that I can come back better prepared, better equipped to lead this church, to teach this church, to walk with this church. And so I want everyone’s support in this and I’m going to step back. want you to pray for my family.

Austin J. Holt (38:24)
Yes.

Aaron Smith (38:35)
We’re okay, there’s things that I need to work on. There’s things that our family needs to grow in and I need to be there.

Austin J. Holt (38:41)
Yeah,

dude, would be maybe we need to start a movement called like the pastor sabbatical family focus movement because it’s missing, man. Like it’s it’s completely missing, you know.

Aaron Smith (38:45)
Dude, would.

Yeah. Well, and

then, but in any, in any role, like in any of these, always say this, like, we shouldn’t be sacrificing our marriages on the altars of ministry, quote unquote ministry. Like, this other thing over here is more important. so I need to give all my attention to that. And this thing, you just need to be okay. And this needs to be put on the back burner. And it’s like, well, you’ve literally just sacrificed the most important ministry of your life, which is showing the gospel through how you love your wife.

Austin J. Holt (39:03)
Yeah, right. Yeah.

Aaron Smith (39:22)
And then raising children to know and love God.

Austin J. Holt (39:27)
Yeah,

that’s right. And you know, it’s even trickier and we definitely don’t have to tangent on this too much. But what’s even trickier is with a lot of modern church culture, volunteers are so almost overly praised and then they’re feeling under praised at home. And then it’s very easy to over serve at church and be homeless.

Aaron Smith (39:46)
because you’re getting something

there that you may be not getting at home.

Austin J. Holt (39:50)
Exactly. And this

is something that we talk to pastors about a lot. talk to ministry leaders a lot about it. So they’re in ministry and there’s wins happening for the kingdom, Like, salvations are happening, baptisms are happening, ministries are growing, all that. for example, at my church, I manage a team at our church which has about 70 volunteers in it. And part of how I keep all those volunteers really engaged is by appreciating them and encouraging them and helping them stay excited and like…

Hey, you’re going the kingdom, you’re blessing the kingdom like you are doing all this amazing work. What we have to be careful about is making sure that people are winning at home too. Because it can be a slippery slope where it’s like, well, everyone loves me at church. I’m not being nagged at church. I’m not being picked apart at church. I’m not being criticized at church. And I’m just constantly crushing it with all these wins and know, God’s wins. You know what I’m saying? And then when I go home, it’s like some reality sets in like.

Aaron Smith (40:29)
yeah.

Austin J. Holt (40:45)
You know, like we’re dealing with kids, we’re dealing with bills, we’re dealing with finances, we’re dealing with logistics, we’re dealing with all the stuff that’s not fun. And so I believe another way the church could step up their game on a huge level is how do we make sure, especially church staff, especially church volunteers, especially people who do a lot of ministry, how do we make sure that their ministry, the one God entrusted to them, like we’re saying, is absolutely the number one.

Aaron Smith (40:50)
All this stuff that’s not fun,

Austin J. Holt (41:13)
and to empower them. When someone needs to take a break from serving on our team at church, I like to think of myself as a burnout manager. I want to make sure that, like, oh, hey, are you sitting with your wife also? Are you guys sitting on Sunday mornings instead of just serving? Are you also sitting in service? And I try to make sure that they are because sometimes they’re like, oh, I haven’t served or we need more people to serve. And I’m like, hey, other people are worrying about that.

Aaron Smith (41:13)
Mm.

Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (41:43)
I want you with your spouse in the sanctuary on Sunday mornings. If you do not do that, I don’t want you serving. know, and we got to start. Yeah, man, we just got to start celebrating and encouraging that if you’re winning in your marriage, you’re winning at the peak ministry. And from that place, then all of your other ministries can thrive and can grow. And I want to see the church steward that statement more.

Aaron Smith (41:51)
Yeah, that should be prioritized.

Austin J. Holt (42:13)
and have more faith that God will backfill volunteers if we need it. Because I know pastors are afraid to say that because, they don’t want to lose. Yeah, and it’s yeah, so.

Aaron Smith (42:17)
Okay, yeah, other friend to lose, yeah.

I just wanted to extrapolate a practical from what you just shared for all my listeners. This is something I know that I need and I know every every listener needs it is encouragement. And it goes so far in your marriage. Going to your wife and encouraging, like overly encouraging, like going out of your way to highlight all the things that she does on a normal day to day basis that it’s required. It’s like it just needs to happen.

Austin J. Holt (42:37)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Aaron Smith (42:53)
It’s a normal thing. Like, of course, if you don’t do it, it’s not going to get done. just, wow. Like without you, we wouldn’t function. Wow. Like what you do on a daily basis just is such a blessing to me and the kids. Wow. Like that thing you did is just such an honor to me and really like highlighting those things and encouraging your bride and wives listening. This probably, I don’t want to say it would be more

more valuable, it’s going to be probably equal. But going out of your way to highlight how the things that your husband does, the things that he’s expected to do, the things that he’s going to do anyway, the things that he must do, and really encouraging those things. And especially, this is just a tip just in general, if you want to see something repeated, focus on it, highlight it. If you want to see, I can’t, oh, you know who it was, it was Jordan Peterson.

Austin J. Holt (43:46)
Focus on it. Yeah. Yep. That’s right.

Aaron Smith (43:52)
He’s like, you want to get someone to stop doing something, punish him for it. So like, your husband comes in and wants to give you a hug and you’re like, no, like don’t touch me. I’m like dirty right now or you’re dirty. And he’s like, that’s a great way to get him to stop wanting to give you a hug. He’s like, but the opposite. Go ahead.

Austin J. Holt (43:57)
Yeah, that’s, yep.

Yeah, that reminds me.

⁓ yeah, it reminds me like our favorite book on parenting. One of our favorite books on parenting is Easy to Love, Difficult to Discipline by Dr. Bailey. And that book is really not even about parenting. It’s about you. mean, she uses the words parenting, but you’re going to learn some stuff about yourself. But exactly. Yeah. What you focus on, you get more of period end of story. You know, the more that you call it out, the more that they’ll get it. The brain loves continuity. Like we could talk all about the psychology of it, but

Aaron Smith (44:25)
Not the parent, yeah.

Austin J. Holt (44:36)
you know, what you are looking for. There’s also your reticular activation system in your brain and what you’re expecting to see, you will see it everywhere. Okay. It’s like, you know, the last car that you bought, let’s just say the last car you bought was a black truck. Well, you see black trucks everywhere, right? Black trucks on your mind. Now you’re seeing it everywhere. Okay. That’s the RAS, the reticular activating system in your brain. And, and it’s the same thing. Like, you know, just this morning, I love that you mentioned this. That’s why I was laughing because I was on the, deck with the kids and the deck, our deck kind of looks out over our fields and there’s like the barn and the goats and

Aaron Smith (44:44)
Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (45:06)
I saw my wife come out of the barn, she just milked all the goats and I just was like, you know, it’s like 7 a.m. and I’m like cheering, I’m clapping on the deck, I’m like, and I’m like, whoa, there’s my sexy goat lady and I’m like, bring us fresh goat milk and I could see this big grin on her face and she was kinda, you know, walking through the field and, but I just like in that moment, I was like, I just wanted her to know and our favorite expression of that encouragement is appreciation, you know, and.

Aaron Smith (45:15)
Yeah.

Ha ha!

Austin J. Holt (45:35)
One saying that I want everyone to just burn into their brains for the rest of their life is what we appreciate appreciates and who we appreciate appreciates. And appreciation is a financial term. means it grows in value. so God gave us a superpower and it’s called appreciation. And here’s what that means. If I appreciate my wife a hundred times, she’ll be worth a hundred times more to me because I’m assigning value to her.

Aaron Smith (45:44)
Hmm.

Dude,

this is the money of this whole episode. We just keep going on this. So, it’s finding value.

Austin J. Holt (46:06)
Yeah. Yeah. And so

it’s, when I call out and I assign value to rate, call it call it radical or active appreciation. And if I say to her, Rachel, like, I appreciate your heart. I appreciate what you do for our family. I appreciate the way that you worship the Lord. I appreciate how you are always calling upon the Holy Spirit, even in so much like no one. There’s like no one I know in my life. I could just start crying right now.

that just is so in tune with the spirit of God and my wife. Like I can see it in her eyes. I can see it in how she moves. And when I appreciate her for that, I’m growing her value to me. And it’s it’s a free technique that no one can take from me. And it’s a superpower. If I choose what like all all my attention that I give to her. It’s almost like if you’re taking a source of light and you’re heating up a stone, right? Like if you take a

you know like a lighter and or a torch and you put it on a stone and you heat this stone up you’re adding the warmth to the stone and then the stone is becoming warmer for you. And so appreciation is amazing because it’s how we realize how valuable things are to us and how they realize how valuable they are to us as well. And who we appreciate appreciates and so even if

It’s like if you’ve ever met someone that has like a 1987 Honda Accord and it’s like a car you would never want, but it’s in perfect condition and they love it it’s their dream car. It’s like cool for them. Like they determined in their heart how valuable this vehicle would be to them.

Aaron Smith (47:40)
And also that person, no matter how much they invest into it, it’s never a loss for them.

Austin J. Holt (47:44)
Boom. That’s exactly right. Yep. And it’s like that’s that’s the ability you have. Like you can look at your wife and you can or your husband and you can literally say, you know what? Today, I’m going to make them more valuable to me. So I’m going to call out everything I can. I’m going to call out everything I can that I appreciate and they will be worth more to you.

Aaron Smith (48:00)
Mm.

I have to write this down.

So what I love about this, well, first of all, it’s true. It’s absolutely true, but I think there’s a lot of, I’m thinking about crypto, which is really funny. Literally you’re talking and I’m about the crypto market and I’m thinking about the stock market and something drops in value, most people start selling it. They go, I’m going to get rid of this.

Austin J. Holt (48:17)
Yeah. huh. Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron Smith (48:32)
But the person that sees the value of that asset will buy more of it. They’ll think, I’m going to buy more of this right now. And so this appreciation concept, it’s almost single sided in a sense of I can like, I’m going to appreciate my wife. I’m going to add value to her regardless of her changing or being anything different. She may not on some level appreciate on her own. I’m using these same terms. It’s kind of weird, but

Austin J. Holt (48:36)
That’s right, yep. That’s good, man, that’s good.

Aaron Smith (49:02)
The amount of value that I’m attributing to her, it’s almost regardless of her. I’m going to her, I’m coming to her. It’s not like I’m waiting for her to appreciate in value or change in some way that I’m looking for her to change for me to then appreciate her. But often I think that’s what we do. We’re looking for our spouse to become something different, to appreciate in value, to become something more valuable to us without us appreciating them, without us looking at it that way.

Austin J. Holt (49:05)
Yeah, it’s that’s right.

I know.

Aaron Smith (49:33)
before we’ll appreciate them, before we’ll be thankful for them. But what you’re saying is, yeah, all the men are probably thinking like, yeah, financially, but the women are gonna be thinking much more emotionally. on the other hand, it’s like, if I’m going to love my spouse or if my wife’s gonna love me, she can love me despite me. She can attribute value to me and see the value in me and be thankful to God.

Austin J. Holt (49:36)
Yeah. And that’s how we build equity. That’s how we build equity in each other.

Yeah, like equity, yeah, I get that, yeah.

Aaron Smith (50:01)
look to her father and say, I’m just so thankful that my husband does these and takes care of me in this way and takes care of our children this way. And that a tip I was going to give to the women, because specifically like there’s a lot of wives that I think probably many wives desire their husbands to spiritually. And I know there’s many husbands that want to lead, but maybe don’t feel qualified, maybe don’t know how to, maybe are afraid to, maybe have tried and been shot down, you know, and so they give up.

Something that a very easy practical step for a wife to take is when your husband does something that is leadership. OK, so like let’s say goes to one of your kids and just really gets down on their level and is patient with them. Right. And like it gives them an encouraging word like, I know that was hard. I just want to tell you good job for not, you know, not having an outburst of anger. I just want to encourage you. And you see that go to him and encourage that.

Austin J. Holt (50:58)
Right, call it out.

Aaron Smith (50:58)
That was

so awesome that you did that, honey. I’m just so proud of you. I thought that was so powerful and so beautiful. And our son’s going to be so, or our daughter’s going to be so encouraged by that. Like, appreciate those things. So look for the ways that your spouse is already leading and show abundant appreciation for it. Because the only thing that happens when you do that is he’ll do more of it. He will, he will do more of it. Yeah.

Austin J. Holt (51:22)
Yeah, that’s right. Yeah, we follow appreciation. Yeah, we follow

it, man. It’s like it’s like a drug and it’s it’s a drug that God wants us to engage in. You know, I mean, that’s I mean, think about the countless scriptures about how to build people up, to speak life into each other, to have words that are like honey, you know, and because God made us be relational. Exactly.

Aaron Smith (51:37)
dude. It’s like the majority of the New Testament

is how we are toward each other to encourage to read to.

Austin J. Holt (51:42)
Yeah,

because he made us relational. he made us, you know, there’s a type of psychology world that we pull from. It’s called interpersonal neurobiology. And it’s by a guy named Dr. Dan Siegel. And he talks about how literally the brain physiologically changes within the proximity of close relationships. And to me, I’m like, yeah, that’s God. Like, God made it to where if I speak life over my wife enough, the neural pathways in her brain will literally change. They’ll literally change.

Aaron Smith (52:07)
Mm-hmm.

Austin J. Holt (52:12)
so that the go-to thoughts she has, it goes from self-criticism to self-appreciation quickly. It goes from fear to hope. It goes from maybe doubt to faith. And I can help reprogram, this is stuff we teach in our program, I can help reprogram those neural pathways in her brain by the life I speak over her. it’s God’s, people don’t wanna talk about how faith and psychology mix, it’s all God, it’s all God, right? Like heart, soul, mind, strength.

Aaron Smith (52:15)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Austin J. Holt (52:41)
And when we learn to leverage those four dimensions of who we are, we can just level up our marriage like none other. And I know for a fact, when I speak life over my wife, it will change the way she thinks. Neuroplasticity, our brain.

Aaron Smith (52:41)
Yeah.

Yeah, yep.

This verse has come up the last episode. I recorded one yesterday with another person and this scripture came up. 12, 2. not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. scripture confirms what you just said about the way we are changed and transformed is when our minds change.

Austin J. Holt (53:22)
Yep. my favorite dude, one of my favorite Greek words of all time is transformed in its metanoia. And that yeah, that that word of metanoia, it’s it’s like so much bigger than even transformed. It’s like. Yeah, yes, it’s like completely new. It’s like.

Aaron Smith (53:29)
You said it earlier,

It’s where we get metamorphosis from.

You’re new, you go

from the little worms to now you’re a butterfly.

Austin J. Holt (53:44)
Exactly. And that’s where

things like trauma can be resolved. That’s where old stories can be turned into new stories. It’s where blocks in the brain can be dissolved. know, it’s where habits can be transformed. It’s where addictions can be set free is when our mind is transformed and we can literally be that for our spouse. That’s ministering to our spouse. It’s taking the ministry of the gospel and giving it into the ministry of our marriage. You know, and and then when we do that,

Aaron Smith (53:50)
Hmm.

Austin J. Holt (54:14)
Again, back to the leverage, right? Like when we do that, all of our other ministry is 10 times as effective.

Aaron Smith (54:22)
I was just going to say that the part of the so speaking that the words of life and encouragement and appreciation to your spouse not only could change them but in practicing doing that it’s essentially practicing what the scriptures say when we’re to be giving thanksgiving to God and looking at what is pure and good and honorable of note and noteworthy and in thinking on these things thinking on things that are above and not things that are on earth and

Austin J. Holt (54:38)
Yes. Yeah.

Aaron Smith (54:49)
That transforms us from being people that are critical, people that are becoming bitter, looking at the negative all the time, looking at things that we’re not thankful for, but instead becoming people of thanksgiving. Because that’s essentially what that is. You’re being thankful for the thing that your spouse is doing, for the way they are being, for the things that they’re operating in and the things that they’re saying. And it makes you a more thankful person.

Austin J. Holt (55:02)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Aaron Smith (55:15)
And it’s something that becomes more second nature to you as you do those things and practice those things.

Austin J. Holt (55:19)
Yeah,

man, it will. And I want to just comment on one thing. I know we’re about to run out of time that you said a second ago about, you know, wives notice when your husband is leading. And we teach we teach a lot of work on like the masculine feminine flow, masculine feminine energy. Just last night, we did this huge training for this group of like really epic entrepreneurs. And we’re teaching about sex and how it’s the exact same way in sex, you know. And but, you know, at the end of the day.

When you look at masculine feminine flow, here’s what we got to understand is, you know, for a lot of couples, they come to us and they’re kind of like in a locked up downward spiral. OK, one’s not appreciating, the next one’s not appreciating and one’s not feeling appreciated, so they don’t appreciate. And so sometimes it’s like egg chicken, chicken egg. Right. I personally believe that the buck stops with the husband at the end of the day. So like if you’re in a marriage where you feel like you’re spiraling a little bit or you’re stuck in a cycle like men, I’m calling you up and out. Do your best.

to step up and go, you know what, I’m going to take 100 % responsibility for our disconnect and I’m going to start loving, appreciating and honoring and doing it long enough till your wife trusts you again because the feminine will sometimes put up a fight and wait for the masculine to be strong long enough before she trusts the masculine again. But here’s the most beautiful thing, guys, when you can just ignite that cycle, reignite that cycle where my appreciation for Rachel fuels her femininity.

That femininity then starts to trust me more. And then when she trusts me more, I become more confident and I lead more. And if I lead more, I get better results. She sees my better results. She believes in my leadership even more. And it does this. And but here’s here’s what has to happen in every marriage. There’s got to be three things. There’s got to be we got to be led by the spirit. Period. OK. I’ve advised in many marriages all around the world. And the one thing I can tell you that is unequivocally true that I’ll take to my grave.

Aaron Smith (56:51)
and

Mm-hmm.

Austin J. Holt (57:12)
Without God, you can have an OK marriage. You will never have the type of marriage that you could have unless it’s fully centered around Christ. number one. Number two, you and your spouse must take 100 percent responsibility for your own integrity. And here’s what I mean by that. Agreements are between people. OK, Aaron and I had an agreement that we would do a podcast interview today. That was an agreement. OK, you have agreements with your spouse, but commitments are between you and God.

Aaron Smith (57:21)
Amen.

Austin J. Holt (57:41)
And when you committed to love your spouse, through rich or through poor, through… Huh? Exactly. It was regardless of them. It was between you and God. You were saying, God, I commit to you that I will love and honor this person no matter what. So we both, second thing is we both take 100 % responsibility. But here’s the magic. OK, this is is what I want everyone to to really soak in as we wrap up here in a second. Here’s the third part. Third part is I’m going to make it easy on my spouse to love me.

Aaron Smith (57:44)
I was regardless of them. It was regardless of them.

Mm-hmm.

Yes,

yes.

Austin J. Holt (58:11)
I’m going to make it easy on them to be in 100 percent. Rachel takes 100 percent for herself. I take 100 percent responsibility for me, but I’m going to make it easy on Rachel to be a respectful wife. If I’m running around like a fool, out of integrity, it’s going to be hard for her. She’s going to be like, all right, I respect you. Here’s what I want. Here’s what I want. I would want the

Aaron Smith (58:27)
Super hard. Yep. Yep. But she doesn’t.

Austin J. Holt (58:39)
wealthiest, best looking, most successful, most God fearing, most incredible man in the universe to try to take my wife and for her to be like, do you not know my husband? Like, do you not know who Austin Holt is? Like, have you met him before? Like, get out of here, dude. Like, he’s my guy. Like, I want my wife to look at me like that, but she’s not going to unless I give her a reason. OK, and so I just want to encourage everybody like

Aaron Smith (58:50)
you

Austin J. Holt (59:07)
You can get in that upward spiral, that upward cycle by honoring God first, leading your spouse to God, taking full responsibility for your own integrity, but make it easy on your spouse to win. Make it easy on them. It’s like every time a pastor or a leader or anyone comes to us with like a moral failure or infidelity, it’s because they both made it hard on each other to stay faithful. Rarely is it

Aaron Smith (59:21)
Yep.

Austin J. Holt (59:35)
They had this incredible marriage. Exactly. And then one of them was like, ⁓ I’m out. They made it. They both created a slippery slope for each other.

Aaron Smith (59:38)
Yep, and he just went off.

So I want to just, that was awesome. I want to summarize it in two things. What I always say, your obedience to God is not dictated by your spouse’s actions. So like our obedience to Christ and the word of God is not dictated by how our spouse behaves. Now, the second part is, that I don’t remember what the exact scripture is, but not causing our brothers to stumble, not operating in a way like you said, makes it hard for our wives to honor us, to respect us, to love us.

Austin J. Holt (59:50)
HMMM

That’s right.

That’s right. Yep.

Aaron Smith (1:00:16)
and vice versa, wives not making it hard for your husband to lead and to love as Christ. So it’s like a, yeah, amen.

Austin J. Holt (1:00:22)
Yeah, yeah, right. Make it easy on him. Make it easy on him to win. know, like

it’s like for me, it’s like the reason I take good care of my health and I work out and I eat well and I don’t drink and I don’t do any of crazy stuff is because I want to be as irresistible to my wife as possible. I want to set her up for success in even our intimacy. Like I want to do everything I can, you know, like everything I can so that she does not struggle.

Aaron Smith (1:00:50)
Amen.

Austin J. Holt (1:00:52)
Because I want her to win. And I want to win.

Aaron Smith (1:00:55)
Amen. That was encouraging. Austin, thank you so much for your time. Before we leave, where can people find you and get connected with you?

Austin J. Holt (1:01:03)
Yeah, easiest place would be our website which is consciouschristianmarriage.com. You can also find us on YouTube for our podcast, the Conscious Christian Marriage podcast. We’re also on every major podcast platform out there. yeah, website, podcast. Man, we’d love to connect with anyone here that’s listening today. And Aaron, man, it was a pleasure to get to hang with you. I love the impact that your ministry is having on the world. And I don’t say this lightly. I truly see it as an honor and a gift.

to be able to get to hang with you today. And who knows, maybe this will be episode one of 12 or something with us.

Aaron Smith (1:01:38)
Let’s do it. Awesome. Thank you so much and ditto. feel the same way.

It honor having you and God bless you and your family and pray that God keeps using you guys in marriages around the world. Thank you.

Austin J. Holt (1:01:47)
Yeah, same man, thank you.